Transportation. - 24 those terms, by which we were to have the some who had voluntarily emigrated to onerous duty of defending and protecting avoid being brought before tribunals of them, but to exercise no substantial authority. He hoped that an argument so derogatory to the dignity of Parliament and to the Crown, would not be used in that House. The right rule to act upon was this the Legislature must listen to the desires of the colonists; they must hear their prayers with every disposition to accede to them; and whatever was consistent with the common good of all we were bound to grant; while those demands which were not based on justice, and were inconsistent with the general welfare of the whole empire, we were bound to oppose. The true test of statesmanship-that which made the difference between a statesman and a mere shallow politician-was to be able to discriminate between one case and the other, to know when justice required concession, and when their duty to the Crown and the empire prescribed firmness. Let them apply that rule to Van Diemen's Land. How far was the demand just, how far was it supported, not by popular clamour, but by reason, that they should not merely put an end to transportation to Van Diemen's Land, but that they should do it so precipitately as not to leave themselves time to consider and discuss any other mode of punishing convicts, nor time to take Parliament into their counsels, as by the constitution they were bound to do. How far was it just that Van Diemen's Land should demand from us, not only concessions, but concession so hasty and precipitate as that? In order to arrive at a correct decision on the subject, they were bound to look at the origin of this colony. The whole population of Australia had been created by the transportation system-even New Zealand, distant as it was, for it would not have been available for settlers but for the wealth and resources created in that part of the world by the system of transportation. Some threefourths of a century ago the Government of this country found that part of the world utterly uninhabited and untrodden by civilised man, and expressly with the view of sending convicts there had fitted it for receiving thousands and thousands-the numbers would soon be millions-of their fellow countrymen; and this had been done at an enormous outlay, incurred expressly for convict purposes. How had the free population arrived there? Some as convicts, some as voluntary exiles, and even among the persons who were making the loudest clamour on the subject, there were justice. They were the descendants of convicts, or they were persons who went out, under the inducements held out by Lord Bathurst, to avail themselves of cheaper and better labour, which the system of sending convicts to that colony supplied. They had succeeded, and he rejoiced at it. Look at the present condition of Van Diemen's Land. It was in possession of wealth far beyond that of any other colony ever founded in the world, and he believed, in proportion to the number of its inhabitants, it possessed many of the advantages of an old country--neat farm-houses, fields divided by hedges, good roads, all the means of civilised life, an efficient police, the most perfect safety-greater than we enjoyed in this country-from offences. All this comfort and wealth, all this fortunate and prosperous state of things, had been created exclusively by the enormous expenditure of this country in sending out convicts and maintaining the convict establishment. Was it, then, just or reasonable, that, precisely at the moment when Van Diemen's Land could receive convicts with the most advantage to itself as well as to the mother country-when the colonists had derived so much benefit from convict labour and convict expenditure-they should turn round on the mother country and say-"We will not only not tolerate receiving convicts, but we will not even give you time, in making the change, to consult Parliament, or to adopt any other plan to relieve you from the great inconvenience which the change must occasion?" Was this a case in which the demands of the colonists-supposing them to make these demands-were based upon justice? He believed, however, that they were greatly wronging the colonists in supposing them to be so unreasonable as to make such a demand as this. The colonists of Van Diemen's Land would, he was convinced, have been quite satisfied with the promise given by the late Government; and if the present Government had adhered to that promise they would have done all that was asked, and at the same time have been spared the embarrassment in which they were now placed. It should be borne in mind, that it did not follow, because the clamour was loud, that therefore it was reasonable, or was joined in by the more sensible part of the community, or was of a nature likely to continue. As far as we had the means of judging, Council did not concur in the report in 1847; but it was remarkable to observe of whom this Committee was composed. Its Chairman was Mr. Wentworth, now the oracle of the other side; and another of its leading members was Mr. Lowe, who was also now a determined opponent of transportation. Yet Sir Charles Fitzroy stated that up to the end of the Session of 1848, since which time the system had certainly not become worse, but better, these gentlemen professed their unreserved concur In that year, too, the Legislative Council deliberately came to a resolution, requesting that convicts should again be sent to them. But more than this. The present Chairman of the Anti-Convict League was one Mr. Cooper; and he found from the colonial newspapers that this same gentleman was a member of an association which was formed in 1846 by the settlers in Port Philip, for the purpose of raising money to defray the expense of importing "expirees" there was every indication that this opinion against convicts was not adopted on sound reason and adequate grounds. In the first place, the cry was quite new, and it was no long time since the cry was all the other way. Any objection on the part of the colonists had never even been heard of when he began to attend to the subject; and he might be permitted, in passing, to observe that he was one of those who had many years ago assisted in pressing the subject on the attention of the other House of Parliament, and who had been most anx-rence in the report of the Committee. ious to put an end to transportation as it was then conducted, for the purpose of arriving at the very plan which had been lately in operation; because, without giving himself credit for superior discernment, he might state that nearly twenty years ago he had expressed an opinion in favour of a plan founded on the very principles which had been adopted in 1847. But when the change was then proposed, the colonists and newspapers were as rabid in their opposition to it, and in denouncing all who ob--that was, not persons who had undergone jected to the system of transportation, as they were now on the other side. They were as ready then to denounce as enemies of their country any one that should venture to suggest the possibility of there being any abuses in the existing system of transportation. Nor had this feeling changed up to a very recent period. He held in his hand an extract from the Report of a Committee of the Legislative Council of New South Wales, which sat on the subject in 1846; and it seemed to be the theory of that Committee, that people at home ought to commit crimes in order that there might be plenty of labour in the colonies; for they came to a resolution to the effect that not fewer than 5,000 male convicts should be annually transported to New South Wales. Nor was the Committee at all apprehensive that any moral evil of any sort or kind would follow the importation into the colony of so large a number of convicts; because they argued that the free population had obtained so great a head and mastery over the convict population, that if the proposal was carried out, the vast absorbing and dispersing powers of the colony would prevent the convicts from ever swamping the free population, as they had done in Van Diemen's Land. Thus they would see that the Committee agreed with him in thinking that the fitness of a colony to receive convicts, increased with the increase of its free population. It was perfectly true that the the improved system of convict discipline, but those who had composed the probation gangs in Van Diemen's Land, at a time when their discipline was notoriously bad. Again, he found that at the present time a very large number of the most respectable and intelligent settlers in Van Diemen's Land had signed a petition, praying that the system might be continued. He believed it was not upon the table of the House, but he had seen it in a colonial newspaper, and he had no doubt as to its authenticity. At the same time, he was far from denying that there were many persons in the colonies who entertained a very sincere opinion against transportation; but he thought the circumstances he had mentioned showed that the opinion had not been very deliberately or very soberly formed. On the contrary, he believed that it might be mainly traced to the language which had been held in this country. People here talked about "the disgrace that attached to penal colonies;" and had asserted that it was the objection entertained to a penal colony which had prevented emigration to Van Diemen's Land, until the colonists had begun to feel it. The colonists were very sensitive about what was said and thought of them in the mother country; and, though there was perhaps a little vanity in this, the feeling was on the whole praiseworthy, and did them credit. He only wished they would estimate a little more correctly what the opinion of this country really was-what was really thought from America, or even England. However, with regard to this question by reasonable as the Legislative Council had spoken, he men-and what really. was the effect of must assume that it expressed the opinions preventing settlers going to those colonies. of the community; and, right or wrong, If they supposed it was the penal character that opinion was, that transportation should of the colonies that prevented people going, cease. But when he was told that the inthere never was a greater mistake. He habitants of Van Diemen's Land and Westhad told their Lordships already that the ern Australia would rebel, and that the exfirst free settlers that went to New South ample of the American colonies would be Wales were induced to go there by the wise followed, he could hardly forbear from smilregulations of Lord Bathurst, and that they ing at the perfectly ludicrous contrast bewent there for the sake of the cheap labour tween the two cases. What similarity was they obtained. It was only three years there between the strong feeling which had since the first convicts were sent to West- led to the throwing of tea into Boston harern Australia. At that time the difficulties bour, and the feeling which did not prevent of the colony had become so great, and its the scenes which took place at the arrival prospects were so apparently hopeless, that of the convict ships? Why, in a recent many of the inhabitants were on the point of paper there was a most graphic account of abandoning the settlement. But already the tumult which such an event occasioned. the effect of sending convicts there had been Even the assistance of the military had to to produce great prosperity; and now he be invoked, to restrain the crowds of rich actually found the population there con- and poor who assembled-not to drive away gratulating themselves on the fact that in the convicts from their shores-but to sethe short time that had elapsed since the cure their services. What a contrast besending of convicts to Western Australia, tween the persons who had indulged in this a most useful accession had been made foolish talk in the colonies, and the great to the better classes of their society. Did men of the American revolution-men not noble Lords really believe that if the nu- less distinguished for their moderation than merous persons in this country who were their firmness; men whose moderation was desirous of emigrating, and who had a lit- such, that had there been the smallest intle money to invest, were offered land in fusion of political wisdom in the councils Van Diemen's Land at a moderate price, of this country, the calamitous struggle, with a gratuitous passage there, and at the and the secession of those colonies, would same time a plentiful supply of cheap con- never have taken place. He said again the vict labour, as well as a market for their Government were not bound to adopt the produce at the high prices which they must precipitous step which appeared to be concommand since the discovery of gold-did templated. No grounds had been shown they really believe that persons contempla- why Her Majesty's Government should not ting emigration would not soon find out have waited to consult Parliament on this that Van Diemen's Land was the place to important subject, nor did it appear that go to in order to get rich-especially if any efficient arrangements had been made they saw that there was such an admirable for the disposal of the convicts in the event police that they might enjoy perfect safety? of the regulations which were in force in They might talk till they were tired about 1852 being abandoned. He must now rethe moral disadvantages of a convict popu- fer for a moment to the Amendment which lation, but with such prospects they would had been placed upon their Lordships' panever prevent persons from going there. per by the noble Earl near him (the Earl Certainly if he were contemplating emi- of Chichester). If that noble Earl really gration, Van Diemen's Land would have wanted to take the sense of the House been the colony he would have chosen upon the propositions embodied in that while convicts continued to be sent there. Amendment, he (Earl Grey) would appeal But if transportation ceased, any man that to him to bring them forward at a fitting expected to make his livelihood otherwise time in the shape of a substantive Motion, than by the labour of his own hands, would and to let the House decide upon them in be insane to go there; because it was obvi- that form. The Amendment of the noble ous that no produce he could raise by the Earl was utterly beside the question which means of labourers, to whom he must pay he (Earl Grey) had now brought under the such wages as would deter them from going consideration of their Lordships. If he to the diggings, would have any chance of was prepared-which he was not—to agree, competing in the market with that brought without reserve, in all the opinions expres that your Lordships have just heard, I cannot help entertaining some hope that the noble Earl will not himself be disposed to press his Motion upon the House. In the first place, I must observe that this Motion is one of a very unusual character. It is, I think, an intervention of a description rarely attempted towards the legitimate exercise of the prerogative of the Crown, and the discretion of the Executive Government. The noble Earl seems to think that we have taken a step in this matter without having the sanction of Parliament to authorise it. We have done no such thing. Had we been disposed to take any step at variance with the law, or requiring the sanction of Parliament, of course we should most readily have come down and requested your Lordships to authorise such a proceeding. But we have done nothing of the kind. All we have done has been that which, sed by the noble Earl in that Amendment, he (Earl Grey) would say, instead of that being a reason against adopting the Address to the Crown which he proposed, it was a still stronger reason than any that he had alleged in favour of that Address. What did the noble Earl contend? The language of that Amendment was utterly incomprehensible. It talked about sending convicts to colonies which were "incapable" of receiving them. Surely that must be a mistake, for it was not common sense. The noble Earl wished the Government to devise a system of secondary punishments which should be as much dreaded and as reformatory as transportation. Why, that was a problem which every civilised nation had been attempting to solve for the last century. Yet the noble Earl demanded an immediate solution. Was that rational? Again, the noble Earl distinctly recommended additional means of secondary whether right or wrong, wise or unwise, punishment in this country, and admitted that new buildings would be necessary. Was it then reasonable to put an end to transportation before these further arrangements had been provided? Surely this alone was sufficient to prove his (Earl Grey's) case. If, however, the noble Earl did press his Amendment, he (Earl Grey) trusted the House would deal with it as merely an indirect way of evading a question which for the honour of their Lordships' House, and for the good of the country, they were bound one way or the other to decide. Surely the course the Government had taken was an erroneous one; but it was still not too late for Parliament to interfere, and he asked them therefore to agree to the Resolution of the terms of which he had given notice, namely "That an humble Address be presented to Iler Majesty, praying that Her Majesty will be graciously pleased to give directions that the arrangements with respect to the punishment of Criminals sentenced to transportation, which were in force in the year 1852, may not be changed in such a manner as to prevent the ultimate removal of such offenders from this country until a full account of any contemplated alteration in the above arrangements shall have been laid before Parliament, and till Parliament shall have had an opportunity of considering the measures it may be intended to adopt previously to their being carried into execution." The EARL of ABERDEEN: My Lords, perhaps it may be convenient that I should thus early state in general terms, although very shortly, the view which Her Majesty's Government take of this most important subject. And I do so, I confess, the more readily, because, notwithstanding the speech it was perfectly competent, in the exercise of the prerogative of the Crown, for the Executive Government to do. Now, my Lords, I agree with the noble Earl in thinking that hitherto this subject has always been treated as not belonging to any party consideration in this House. The subject is one which interests our social condition so nearly, and is so important to the welfare and happiness of such vast numbers of our fellow-subjects, that it has been put aside from all considerations of a party nature; and certainly I have no reason to imagine that the noble Earl would attempt to meet this question in any dif ferent spirit. That the noble Earl himself, and the right hon. Gentleman who was his Colleague at the Home Office, have made great improvements in the nature of convict discipline, both at home and abroadto that I can bear the fullest testimony that is possible. At the same time I must be permitted to observe, that the difficulties under which we labour at this moment, however unintentionally on his part, have been mainly created by the noble Earl himself. The question, the practical question, after all-notwithstanding what the noble Earl has said about the abolition of transportation, of which nothing of the kind has taken place-the practical question is, whether we should continue transportation to Van Diemen's Land or not. Now, I say that the noble Earl has made it impossible, for this reason-I do not say intentionally, but such is the fact, and your Lordships will see, by the merest statement of the facts as they occurred, that such is the case. In 1846, when my right hon. Friend | They, therefore, undoubtedly, received the Mr. Gladstone was Secretary for the Colo- EARL GREY: That colony not being originally a convict colony. The EARL of ABERDEEN: Very well. The noble Earl, of all men, was surely the one who ought to pay some respect to the declarations of the Legislatures of those colonies. Is it only, then, against the Church of England that the noble Earl supports the declarations of Legislative Assemblies? Is it only in Canada that the Legislative Assembly is to be supported in the wishes it expresses; and are colonies which protest against convict settlements being forced on them-are they alone not to be listened to, and not to receive any attention from your Lordships? I say, my Lords, that the noble Earl ought at least to be consistent, and give its proper weight to the voice of the Assemblies he has himself helped to constitute in those colonies. My Lords, the noble Earl has throughout treated the whole of this subject as if we had taken a decision to abolish transportation. Now, we have not only done no such thing, but we are anxious to preserve the system of transportation. Undoubtedly, the field in which it can be exercised is diminished. We have a difficulty to contend with; and, as I have already said, whether designedly or not, that difficulty has been mainly created by the noble Earl himself. But there are settlements which still remain; and I think that, by good administration at home, the number of convicts transported may be so diminished, that it may be possible to find means for the accommodation of them in those restricted territories to which I refer. They may be sent, for example, to Western Australia. I do not deny-on the contrary, I |